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The Recipe For Creating a Culinary Connected Device

ABOUT THIS EPISODE

It’s hard enough to marry the worlds of hardware and software when creating a connected device.

Imagine throwing another specialized discipline with its own language and rigid ways of working into the development process too.

That’s exactly what David Rabie, Founder & CEO at Tovala, dealt with in creating a company that pairs a smart oven with a meal delivery service.

In this episode, he describes how they established a culture of collaboration that brought all three disciplines together under a unified mission.

Topics covered:

  • Bridging the worlds of culinary and tech
  • The strategy behind using Kickstarter
  • How a marketing pivot drove new growth
  • How finding product-market fit led to operational challenges

Our exclusive discount code for Tovala to purchase the oven for $89 and includes six orders is: verypossible

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We're going after a different problem and and kind of a different core customer than those meal kids. And what makes us unique kind of the ability to access that customer segment and solve that problem is the oven and the connected nature of our whole business. You are listening to over the Air Iot connected devices and the journey, brought to you by vary. In each episode we have sharp, unfiltered conversations with executives about their IOT journeys, the mistakes they made, the lessons they learned and what they wish they'd known when they started. All right, hey everyone, welcome back to over the air, IOT connected devices and the journey. My name is Ryan Processer, and today we're joined by David Rabbi, founder and CEO of to Valla. We're going to be talking about the recipe for creating a successful connected device that lives at the intersection of food and technology. David, thanks for being on the show. Yeah, my pleasure. I'm excited to be here. So, David, you know pun alert. Obviously, I dropped recipe on purpose. You guys are doing some really cool things with food and Food Tech. For those that don't know, can you tell us a little bit about to Valla and the mission of making it easier for people to eat better. Yeah, so to Valla is a connected smart oven paired with a chef prepared meal service. And so the ideas we send you meals that are preprepped mostly wrong ingredients. You spend about a minute preparing your dish, scan a barcode and the oven downloads the proper cook cycle from the cloud and cooks your meal automatically and twenty minutes or less. So you get kind of the best parts of home cooking without any of the pain associated with chopping, cutting, marinating, cooking or, of course, cleaning. So that's that's the vision at a high level. So there's some others in what would seem to be the same space, I don't know, like blue apron comes to mind, but you're not really in that space at all. You guys are targeted at busy professionals and and you've you know...

...well, you're here on the show today talking about hardware. Talk to us about what you guys are doing that's a little bit different and the product that comes along with the food. Yeah, so when you when we think about meal kit companies like Blue Apron or hell of fresh or home chef there in the business of helping people learn how to cook and also eliminating the planning and shopping that goes into the weekly meal cooking process. We are we are going after a very different customer and solving a very different problem. We're really focused on people that want a high quality meal on an average Tuesday or Wednesday night and don't have time to do it and and a lot of our customers tend to replace food delivery with Tavalla. So it's folks that are ordering from the door dashes of the world two, three four times a week. And a lot of our customers are people that try blue apron but ultimately churned because it wasn't actually solving their problem. And so we're going after a different problem and and kind of a diff front core customer than those meal kids. And what makes us unique kind of the ability to access that customer segment and solve that problem is the oven and the connected nature of our whole business. Can you, I mean we're going to get into product market fit in a minute, but can you talk a little bit about what you thought was, or you guys felt was that unmet customer need or what your thesis was going in that you thought those companies weren't addressing. Yeah, the core thesis was that on one side you had a bunch of companies that were sending people ingredients, helping them learn how to cook, but customers are still doing the cooking. On the other end, you had a lot of companies sending people food that was fully cooked and asking them just to reheat it in the oven or the microwave. And we felt like the intersection of those two was actually the biggest opportunity because you get to capitalize on people's desire for the best parts of home cooking, the wrong ingredients, the smell the home, the taste of the food, texture of the food, but the convenience of the other end, where it's just scan a bar code and Valla your meal is done. So it was kind of the intersection of high quality and high convenience where we felt like there was nothing on the market really addressing that well, so bridging high quality...

...and and convenience. So like, on the one side, you guys are trying to really nail the service you're providing, so you've got this this hardware, you've got the service behind it, which is software. If then, on the other side there's food. You know, you guys are responsible for pulling that together. That, at least from our point of view, very unusual. Can you talk about bridging, I guess, what I will call culinary and tech, you know, and really needing to be masters of three things, hardware, software and and the you know, the food piece of that. What does that look like? Let's start with that. Yeah, it's a great question. That's at the core of what makes our business different. It's what makes the business really hard. It's very hard to operate a business like that. It was very hard to get it off the ground. But it's also what lets us deliver on that value proposition we were talking about. If, if we only did one of those three things, or even two of those three things, we wouldn't be able to send you wrong ingredients that require a minute of preparation and and no cooking. The reason we can do that is we've got chefs in in our D kitchen, we've got chefs in a production facility, we've got software that kind of sits in between everything and we've got an oven that we've built that does the cooking. And so it's this full system very similar to espresso. Or curegg or Peloton as companies that we often look to as comps. That allows us to deliver on kind of this product promise. You know, what makes it hard is you you need multiple different disciplines working together on a unified mission, but with very different work styles, work languages, backgrounds experiences. That makes things really challenging, I'd say, and and we're far from amazing at it. But but I think we have gotten some things right that have allowed us to get to this point. I have to believe that one of the unique challenges of your company is is that you know that difference in skill sets. You know. So you've got people with culinary backgrounds at very you know the company that I run,...

...you know we really have a big focus on hardware, a big focus on software, to say nothing of like having a big focus on food. And how do you bring all of those I mean we struggle just with having hardware and software people be able to be under one roof, for example, like agile engineering. You know, engineers just go nuts when you try to wedge that into their worldview. That says nothing about like introducing a giant group of chefs with their opinions and their workflows. What does that look like for you guys, I mean just culturally. How do you make that work? Yeah, it's a great question and, like I said, I don't think we're the experts by any means. There's, you know, continued challenges on that front. I think a few things that we have done really well are build a strong company culture and one that is very team focused, and so you combine that with a group of people that have a high learning mentality and really believe in the growth mindset. We have a lot of people that want to learn, they want to learn other disciplines and they want to do what's best for the team. So that's a really good recipe, I would say, for minimizing conflict and friction. When folks are trying to work together but have their very different styles, they often share the same goal. So I think that's that's one piece. We've been fortunate to have several people in the company that have become glue factors and and bridges, as I like to say, that are great at speaking multiple languages and understand all the various parts of the business, so they can work really well to bridge gaps between different functions. And we've got folks like this throughout the organization and having those has been game changing for us because they they are the ones that really helped get things done between functions. So I'd say those are those are two of the things. But but again it continues to be challenging and as we had more people, you know, it's a new challenge for everyone that joins. Yeah, I know that you mentioned you worked really closely with your CTEO on the technology...

...development. He was really instrumental in driving a lot of these things forward. Do you, when you think about the technology side of the business like from a chicken egg perspective? Did you first view this as our I guess, did you first and foremost view this as a software problem or a hardware problem on the technology side of your approach? I mean, we hired our first software engineer and first hardware engineer within a month of each other, so hard to say which one was a bigger obstacle. I think probably hardware at the time just felt a little more front and center and higher risk and bigger challenge in some ways. But frankly, there's never you know, if you think about the three stools, the software, hard where and food, we really haven't ever been at a point where it's like, well, one is ten times more important than than the other two. I think right. Really won't makes the business go is that all three of those are really important and you know, for some parts of the organization some are more important than others. For our customers some are more important than others. But, net net, what makes the business really special is that all three of those have to be really important and we have to be really good at all of them. Did it. Can you talk about the so like focusing for a minute on the hardware and then let's move to product market fit? I'm always super interested in how people what that journey look like. But but just staying on the product for a minute, you guys have this oven that you know helps people prepare the food, it scans the bar code, it's like very integrated with the software. To call it just an oven I think underserves what you guys have developed. But for people out there listening that are building a hardware product, they either know or they will soon learn, hardware is very hard. Can you talk about in you guys as hardware journey, how off the shelf is what you've built versus like a total ground up rethink on like what am I thinking of? COUNTERTOP oven is, I don't think the right category to call it. But yeah, can you talk about the extent to which that's a rethink or off the shelf or a blend? Yeah, I'd say it's a...

...blend. It's definitely not an entirely new oven concept and that was very deliberate. You know, we felt like ovens were great tool to begin with and definitely did not need reinvention. That was our thesis. There are other companies that had different thecs on the same device and especially as we thought about what was the primary use case for our customers, and you know the core use cases. You order our meals, you scan of our code and it cooks automatically, and we didn't need to recreate the oven to deliver on that. So we worked with companies that were already making countertop ovens. Some of the critical changes that we had to make, though. Our ovens are steam ovens first off, so that allows the the food to be a lot juicier when you cook it. So they all have you know that we've got two generations of ovens. Each of them had different mechanisms for storing and boiling water and generating steam within the chamber, but it gives the chef's another lever of a different way to heat up the food, and sometimes the steam is combined with dry heat, which is a very powerful way to cook. That's pretty uncommon in the home. It's quite common in the commercial space, but you don't see a ton of steam ovens in folks homes. So that was kind of one piece. And then the second pieces is the connected side. So the oven is WIFI enabled and and that allows us to do a whole host of things, including updating our recipes every single week depending on what's landing in your homes, adding recipes for you to make yourself to the APP, adding grocery items that can cook just by scanning a UPC code. So those are all things that are enabled by the Wi fi connection and that was a major change that we had to make to the the ovens that we were working with. And then, you know, design elements, branding elements, some UX things that we did ourselves as well. So shifting a little bit now to product market fit you talked about. You know, this is an unusual in the home way to cook. Allows the chefs some flexibility provides an outcome that people love as far as the quality of the food. One of the questions I ask everybody on the show is how did you know you were building the right...

...thing? Hardware is so scary, you know, because you may you make it first and you find out later if anybody actually wants the thing. And I think that you guys are the first to have come out of kickstarter that we've ever had on the show. So you got started on kickstarter, got some great traction and never looked back. Can you talk about you know, yeah, can you talk a little bit about that journey? Sure, yeah, it's a great question. First off, really humbled that were the first kickstarter company to be on the PODCAST. A little surprised, but that's awesome to hear. Yeah, so we did kickstarter about a year before we actually were in homes and the gold are was first, prove out some demand for the product and, second, get a base of early adopters that we could kind of test things on. Up until that point we had done a lot of Beta testings just putting the hardware and homes making the food ourselves. The hardware was pretty different. It was something we bought off Amazon and modified and and that gave us some early evidence that people liked what we were doing, but but very nascent and informal. The kickstarter was another positive up. We sold about a thousand units on kickstarter. But our business is not selling ovens, our business is selling food and that was a very hard thing to get hard date on until we were actually in market. So kickstarter was another hey, we reason to believe that we should keep up with this thing. We launched a year later and and it was a bit of Hay. All right, this is it, we're putting it in market. Let's cross our fingers and hope we weren't totally off base and we've got enough here that will learn our way into finding product market fit. And you know, the early data was really positive from customers. People love the food and that that was a huge question mark for us of like, all right, our people actually going to like the food? Are they going to keep ordering it? What is our retention going to look like? And in those early months, even though our many only had five items every week and the ovens were fairly early stage, customers love the products and they stuck around in a pretty big way,...

...especially as we were comparing to really anyone else doing meal, meal kits or prepared food. The challenge was that we could not know, we could not figure out how to acquire new customers. So existing customers love the product and our retention was really strong and because it's a product that people are ordering every week, we had pretty nice revenue figures for a new company, but we were really struggling to translate that into new customer growth and that was about a two year journey, I'd say, from we launched in the summer of two thousand and seventeen and it wasn't until late summer of two thousand and nineteen that we really unlocked it and found product market fit. I remember you saying previously that that retention allowed you to kind of one of the things we hear a lot from from entrepreneurs is like convenient facts allow you to rationalize things away, and you guys had this great retention early on and you said, you know, the world is fantastic, but you were struggling to drive new growth and that was a hard reality. It discovered that it wasn't a product problem, I believe is the discussion from previous and that there was a lot of but that, like elevating marketing really unlocked things for you. Can you talk a little bit about that journey and what it looked like to I don't know if that was customer education or awareness, or maybe you can tell us a little bit about that. Yeah, so the way we got there is we kind of went back to basics. We interviewed some of our best customers. These are folks that were had been with us for a year and a half, love the product, high engagement and we wanted to hear from them. How do they describe to Balla had? What do they tell their friends about to Vallah? Why do they love to Vallah? And we did ten or fifteen of these interviews and really started to pull out some common threads between all of those. So that was kind of part one. Part Two we went and interview people that had spent a lot of time on our website and not actually...

...purchased and we got them on that. We paid them, got them on the phone and just ask them why, what are the reasons you didn't get over the Hump, because clearly something resonated with you that you were going to spend three, four five minutes on our website. And from there we got another list. We took those two things, rebuilt the brand, rebuilt our website and redid our pricing strategy, and those were the three major levers that we used to drive up our conversion rate, which was the real metric we were tracking. We you know, at the time we were acquiring a certain percentage of customers that landed on our website. We needed to get that percentage up by about twenty thirty percent and if we could, the economics would start to really make sense around Lt me to Cak and starting to scale spend on our website and really start to drive growth. And you know, the new website brought a lot more trust for consumers. It helped educate around what we were doing and answered some very fundamental questions for customers about what this product is, how it works, what it isn't. And then the pricing strategy really reduced the barrier for folks to get in and try the product and and those things were massive, massive levers for us and it was almost like overnight things started to click and we had more demand than we could actually fulfill. Interesting so it sounds like there was a number of small iterations, but a few Eureka breakthroughs and pricing was one of them. Yes, and then, not to discredit or diminish you know, these this these hard earned lessons that you guys use to drive growth. But I'm guessing covid was probably pretty good to your business. Is that fair to say that, during a time when people are in their home, a company like yours has become I'm guessing you guys had a pretty good two thousand and twenty. Yeah, Covid was was certainly very good for us. I think we're really, really fortunate that we found product market fit seven months before covid. Sure, because, yeah, it gave us a lot of credibility with investors when we went to raise money during covid that hey, once, once this thing starts to pass and normalize a...

...little bit, our business is not going to fall apart, because we grew. We grew about three and a half four x before Covid, you know, from that point when we found product market fit. But then Covid was definitely a boon. You know, is a huge driver of demand for us. Usage went up. Really every metric went up into the right and did for a long period of time. Operationally. It was hugely challenging because I bet we we produce our own food, so we employ a lot of people, and especially those first few months when no one knew left from right and we didn't really know what covid was and how to keep our team safe. But we had to continue operating to stay in business. Those are very, very difficult times. And on the supply chain side as well, just getting product from our manufacturing partners overseas was a huge challenge and maintaining inventory was hard. And then, similarly, on the food side, prices for commodities were spiking, products for Shure, you know, huge shortages, things like that that we're just unique challenge hinges we hadn't dealt with before. But from a demand standpoint it was great. Two Thousand and twenty we grew the business of ton. I've seen before where some environmental boon, environmental meaning like outside force, breaks it in your favor, in the favor of a company, but they haven't solved the core issues. It can actually be one of the worst things that could possibly happen because they puts everything on steroids for a brief period of time, but it's not sustainable. And to your point about like having solved the product market fit issue a beforehand. You know, you had a repeatable process, you had a sustainable business model and then this just kind of put gas on the fire. Is Out of favorite characterization hunt. A hundred percent. A hundred percent. So everybody that we've ever had in the show that that is an entrepreneur has had to solve some version of their company at one point was on the wrong side of impossible. No company worth owning isn't in some way on the wrong side of that line. Initially. You solve it. It's valuable. No one else has, you know, not at...

...your price point or in your way or whatever. You can you talk about, for Tomala, what that's looked like, what you guys needed to solve. Could be software, hardware, culinary, it could be more than one thing, but what was one or some of those things that you really needed to solve for to be here today having the success you're having? So many it's a long list that. Yeah, I think the marketing one is the most black and white one, that we needed to figure out how to market the product. What was interesting is the core product that we launched with worked really well and the product now is way, way better. But I think even that MVP would still be a very successful business from a just pure product Lens. We needed to build a ton of infrastructure around it to support that. That has been challenging. You know, we produce a lot of meals every week now and building the operational and supply chain expertise and perchuman expertise to do that on a week over week basis with a changing menu is very complicated and it's not something that is unique to us per se. There's other companies doing similar things. But that's a hugely complicated operation that has to work week over week and you know just that there cannot be a breakage there because our customers are expecting to get there are food every single week. So you know, that was one area where when we found product market fit, we weren't ready and it's you know, you try to prepare but it's very hard to know at what point you're going to find it, if ever, and when you do, what it's actually going to mean. And it's funny, you know. We would put it into our our investor presentations of we're going to grow this fast and this is when it's going to happen, but you don't really know how you're going to find product market fit and until you do and what it's going to look like when you find it. And we found it and all of a sudden it was like, okay, the hot potato has gone from the marketing team to the UPS team, the OPS team. We got to figure out how we're going to fulfill all of these meals very quickly. And that's that's a human equation, like it's not. We're not trading in bits, like every customer that we add is more food that we have...

...to ship out of the facility. And and we were. We were caught a little flat footed there. That was that was a big mistake in hindsight, and Hind Sight Two thousand and twenty, but that we didn't react quick enough of Oh my God, this house is on fire and it's just going to the fire is just going to get bigger unless we do everything we can to put it out. And eventually we did. But those are some painful months for some folks on our team. Operational issues. You know that they're they're always measured in months. You know you just went by the time you realize something's wrong. You've now discovered where you're going to spend the next six months of your life focused on, or nine months or whatever. So you talked about hindsight being two thousand and twenty. You know, always love to ask about these face palm allstar moments. Everybody's got them, the thing that you know you went for it and it just it just didn't go your way. was there like a time you can tell us about where you've had all this success but this particular thing was just a total fizzle, dud, something that hasn't gone you guys as way. Yeah, I'd say when we were searching for product market fit, we were looking a lot at Peloton and Peloton's unlock was opening stores and malls and we're like, okay, we should try that. And you know, same issues, like people don't with the bike, like they don't know what makes it special. It's so expensive. They got to get on the bike, watch the take a class and then they get it and we're like Oh, the same thing is true with us. And no one believes the food is going to taste good. They don't understand how it's going to work, like we just have to show it to them. And we had done a lot of events and things and the events felt good. People would give us good feedback, but we just weren't wired in a way where we were tracking things effectively to actually know, like what was the Roi on events like that? Was it actually working? And so we just came back to like hey, if we can't sell this thing in person, how are we ever going to sell it online? Like I'm sure this will definitely work. Let's let's sell in person, let's get a let's open a pop up and and we'll do a pop up so it'll be lower cost.

We could test it out and see how it works, and so you we are still a small team. They were probably two thousand and twenty five of us, and so we opened a pop up the summer of two thousand and eighteen, I think, and it just was a flop, like it really didn't work for us. We had a ton of interest and foot traffic the first couple weeks and it was mainly interest. We weren't moving that many units and then it just fizzled and it was a huge resource train because we needed to staff the place and get food there on a regular basis and it was burning a hole in our pocket because we were like, well, we got to use it. If we have the space, let's figure out how to maximize it. And in hindsight it we were way too early for something like that and it's interesting. We couldn't sell the product in person either, but I think it was for some of the reasons we talked about earlier, like we didn't have a coherent brand message. When folks left the pop up to go to our website, it wasn't a great flow and it was priced poorly and and all those things were problems in real life the same the same way they were just on our website. And Yeah, it was a problem. But even for the folks, and most of our folks are still here, everyone still believes that a pop up will work for us. It's just a matter of when is the right time? Interesting. So it sounds like if you feel like if you had solved for that product market fit, the the pricing, some of those key learnings, if you had already solved for that, maybe the pop up outcome would have gone differently. A hundred percent. I think if we did a pop up now it would probably work reasonably well. I don't actually think it's the right strategy in the near term, but I think it would work because for all the reasons we felt like it should work then. Those, I think, are still true, except now we actually know how to market and sell the thing. So, taking the last twenty five minutes of discussion, the key takeaways that to my mind, one, product market fit is crucial, something we talked about every week on the show. You know, I see you nodding your head. I think everybody in tech is nodding their head. If you don't, if you're not aligned with your with your market, you're you're already dead. I like to...

...say if you have product market fit, nothing else matters and if you don't temp product market fit, nothing else matters. That's right. Well, agree. The second thing you know that that I think stands out from today is having like really effective cross disciplinary communications. We talked about it at the front side of the program but you've got three very different teams, much more different than I think many other companies would. Would maybe have, but every company will have some level of difference. It sounds like you guys have invited. You're being humble and saying you're not the best, but it feels like you've made some investment in trying to get that right. That difficult thing and that that that's been important to you guys as success and and then it feels like the third piece, which I guess is kind of almost nested under product market fit, is differentiation. You know. So you guys are not at all like Blue Apron. You know, there's a group of people that are not interested in learning how to cook, but they do want to eat well at home, and you're saying, Hey, we have you're a busy professional with your own thing going on and you want to eat like you're eating out or eat like you made it yourself. You are the solution for those folks. Correct. Yeah, highly differentiated. So for the folks listening, it's it's Thanksgiving season. It's October for us, but they'll be hearing this in November. thanksgivings just around the corner. What what's next for you guys? What like, what can we see from you from Tovalla in the near future? What are you excited about? What will they be seeing roll out or that would be interesting to know about. Yeah, so the holiday season is big for us. To all, is a great product, a gift to friends, parents, grandparents, children, anyone that could use a more convenient, healthy home cooked option. Holidays are great time and, like a lot of businesses, we definitely run a couple holiday promotions. So keep an eye out around Black Fridays is a great time to watch for its of all eyes. One of the things I'd highlight for q four and and I'd say bigger picture...

...next year and moving on, the goal is just to continue to build on top of the foundation we've got. So continue to add more items to the menu that appeal to a broader and broader group, make the customer experience better and better than it is today and scale up the company. We need more facilities, a lot more people. We're hiring across lots of different functions and and really trying to go to that next level. Okay, I have follow up question. This was not in in the script at all, but so my seventy two year old father his here visiting me right now. He texted me from the airport and he said, and this is something only baby boomers can get away with, he texted me, what is your phone number? Now what you think about that? Hey, this man texted me what is your phone number? And my question to you is, would this be so that that's the level of Tech enablement that I'm dealing with there. Would this be a good gift for somebody with that level of Tech Savvy? Could could he operate this effectively? Do you think so? Shockingly, the answer is yes. We have a ton of customers that are seventy to nine years old, depending on their level of texophistication. Some of them can set up the product. It's pretty simple. You download an APP, it automatically keys in your Wifi Information, it connects your out and automatically. But even that, for for some is too much. In that situation it's generally the the children or the grandchildren that set up the oven and set up the subscription and then that's it. Making the actual meals is very, very, very simple. The the instructions are written out very plainly, not that complicated. Everyone can scan a bar code and once you learn how to do it, once it's super simple. So the actual usage of the product is I'd say there's very few people in this country that could not figure out how to do it. The set up fifty and then the ordering of the meals kind of depend. So we we order it for my wife's grandparents. We pick their meals, but but they do all the cooking themselves. Okay, so for th those of you out there in TV Land, David doesn't know this yet, but...

...we're going to squeeze a discount code out of him. We're going to publish it with this episode and if you got parents out there and you want to buy this for them, just like I am, will put something out there for you guys to make the purchase. So the other question I was always loved to ask people. David, your neck deep in the iote space. You know, we live it breathed as well. WHO's out there doing good work that the folks at home should know about that? Maybe they don't right now. Somebody in the IOTE space. Yeah, one company were very close to and you friends with a lot of folks. There is a company, also based in Chicago called Farmers Fridge and they've started to really expand their footprint across the country. But their core business is making really healthy salads. They do some bowls, they do some breakfast items and and the core initial product where these refrigerators, IOT connected refrigerators in airports, offices, hospitals. That are their beautiful vending machines and they're all glass. You you look at them, you're like. You really want the product. It's very different than a typical vending machine you would look at. Product is made fresh every day, so it's an awesome product. They really leverage internet connectivity to make those fridges work really well and part of what they've expanded into is distribution on a wider basis across the country. So farmers fridges is one that we love and, you know, encourage you to check them out as you're flying to different reports or if you find yourself in the Midwest. The last question, I have great conversation today. I think increasingly people care a lot about their food. For people out there that enjoyed what they've heard today, how can theyre's a good place to follow you? Follow the story, follow the Tovalla Story, follow the David Story. Yeah, I think a few places. I think for for for me, you know, following me on Linkedin is probably one good place for our brand. Instagram is the best place and from a product standpoint it's the website. And just to Vallacom okay, you heard it here. That's it for today. Folks. If you're listening on Apple Podcast,...

US to love it if you could give us a writing. My name is Ryan prosser. Thanks for listening. We'll see you guys on the Internet. You shouldn't have to worry about IOT projects dragging on or unreliable vendors. You've got enough on your plate. The right team of Engineers and project managers can change a pivotal moment for your business into your competitive edge varies. Close Knit crew of ambitious problem solvers, continuous improvers and curious builders know how to turn your ideas into a reality on time and up to your standards, with a focus on mitigating risk and maximizing opportunity, will help you build an Iot solution that you can hang your hat on. Let's bring your Iot idea to life. Learn more at very possiblecom. You've been listening to over the Air Iot connected devices and the journey. If you enjoyed today's episode, make sure to hit subscribe in your favorite podcast player and give us a rating. Have a question or an idea for a future episode? Send it to podcast at very possiblecom see you next time.

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